NSSO- The Non-Sexual Significant Other, Friends, and Affection

So, I've had Polyamory Weekly sitting in iTunes for MANY MONTHS now, being a major podcast junkie.  For some reason, however, I never got around to listening until last week.  Seeing as we've actually started the move from being theoretically poly to actually dating, chatting it up online, and (yes) on at least one or two occasions kissing other people, I figured I really needed to start drawing in as much information and guidance as possible.  If you haven't noticed yet, I'm serious about researching any major life changes I make, especially since this one directly impacts a relationship that is the most fulfilling and beautiful, heartfelt and genuine, loving and magical that I've ever had, and one that I'd like to keep forever.

My phone is set to sync the most recent episode, which as of last week just happened to be a re-podcast of an old episode about Introverts vs. Extroverts.  This was actually quite helpful, as I'm (mostly) an extrovert (although I have my moments where I've finally been tapped out and just need to crawl into a hole to hide), and my husband is (mostly) an introvert (although he enjoys spending time one-on-one or in small crowds with our tiny band of close friends).  We have, of course, over the 12+ years we've been a couple, sorted out how that all looks in our relationship and worked out something that meets both of our needs in terms of social interaction.  I can still see how that might be a new challenge to sort through as we start dating new people.

But that, actually, wasn't the most interesting thing in that podcast for me.  There was a movie review of Carrington, by Joreth of The Inn Between (who has a handful of reviews of poly-ish movies on her site).  Her review was interesting (and I've since seen the movie thanks to Netflix), but one thing stood out in the review-- the concept of the "Non-Sexual Significant Other," or NSSO.  Lucky for us, Joreth also has a glossary of poly terms on her site (and I highly recommend giving it a look-over when you can if you're unfamiliar with poly):

NON-SEXUAL SIGNIFICANT OTHER (NSSO): Someone who fulfills the role of a Significant Other or a romantic partner, but does not include a sexual relationship. Usage: This is not a very common term because many people view a relationship without a sexual content to be "just friends" even within the poly community. However, some people do seperate different forms of love and emotional connections from sexual relationships, and often believe they have a "romantic" or intimate relationship with another person that, for whatever reason, does not include sex. This may include a relationship that resembles a romantic relationship in all ways except, for medical reasons, those involved are not capable of having or choose not to have a sexual relationship.

This idea intrigues me, not because I'm not into having sex with significant others, but because I do believe that over the years, I may have had a few extremely close relationships that were clearly "more than friends," while not being sexual in nature.  While I wouldn't necessarily call them "romantic," they were kind of flirtatious and playful.  One, well over a decade ago,  was with a gay man when we were both single.  One, also a decade or so ago, was with a married mom friend of mine who (along with her son) became like family to our family.  Another was with a single girl friend, and one has been with a married guy friend (whose family was not poly).  None of those were particularly complicated or weird, with the possible exception of the married guy friend.  In that case, the weirdness was overcome by the fact that I was fully aware that people can have loving, emotionally intimate relationships with more than one person at a time without it meaning less love for the "primary" partner (as I was already beginning to think seriously about poly at that time), and I took time to get to know his wife and connect with her in a positive way.  Plus, I have this thing about not wanting to help people cheat (similar to the thing my friend had about not wanting to cheat); this made it much, much easier to keep things platonic, which we did, even as an extremely close friendship developed.

All of that is not to say that I have unintentionally had an NSSO before (because I haven't), but to say that I can see how it could happen, and how it could meet people's needs, even if in a way that isn't culturally normative.  For starters, obviously even people who identify as asexual could be in loving relationships, even polyamorous ones.  Secondly, I actually enjoyed Carrington and loved the interplay between the characters.  I read a few descriptions of it online as a movie about "unrequited love."  I think people who wrote those reviews have a far-too-narrow definition of love.  One movie description goes so far as to say that Carrington's unrequited love for Lytton "ruined her life and ended in tragedy."  This I don't buy for two reasons.  First, any damn fool who watches the movie can tell that (at least as they are portrayed in the movie) Lytton clearly loved Carrington deeply, and enjoyed his unusual partnership with her.  Did it meet their every need and fill every aspect of partnership for them?  No.  But it was still a meaningful relationship from which they both benefited, and in which they both received love.  Secondly, that paints the picture that she hopelessly pined after him, thus causing the tragic end.  SPOILER ALERT (skip to the next paragraph if you don't want to know the ending)...  What actually happened is that Lytton dies from cancer, and on his death bed yearns for Carrington's love, and after his death, she commits suicide from the grief of losing her partner.  What if they had been a traditional couple, married for years?  Would anyone, upon hearing that a wife of 15 years had been through watching her husband endure a painful and horrific death had then killed herself to escape her unbearable grief, then go on to ridicule her choice?  We might not agree with it, either in her case or in general, but we would understand her grief.

All of which brings me to sex and romance.  Does sex define which relationships matter and which don't?  Is a non-sexual relationship only acceptable, valid, and recognized if it is seen as something that is the preparation for a later sexual relationship?  What about romance?  What is "romantic" and what isn't?  Holding hands?  Giving a hug?  Stroking someone's hair?  Leaning into each other on the couch?  Sharing your secrets?  Kissing a cheek or forehead?  It seems that the line between "what friends can do" and "this constitutes a romantic relationship" is nebulous and arbitrary.  On the one hand, when romantic partnership is desired by one or both partners, it makes things feel complicated-- at what point should we call it a Relationship?  On the other hand, when platonic is the goal (either because of orientation or monogamy status, or some other issue), there's always the dance of "how much is okay?"  You try to balance doing what feels natural in the friendship and allowing appropriate expressions of love and caring with not doing more than is "safe" (emotionally, socially, or physically) and making sure everyone's boundaries are honored.

And I think some of this is real, and important, and valid.  I do not WANT to be in anything resembling a romantic relationship with someone, male or female, who is in a monogamous relationship, and will act in a way that honors their important life commitments.  Just as the romantic, crushing part of my brain seems to shut off and not work on friends whose orientation does not match with mine (gay men and straight women), so it turns off for people I know are in monogamous relationships.  There is no crushing.  There is no fantasizing.  While there might be love, expressions of it are kept safely within the boundaries that help me to maintain the friendship in a safe way.  I can love people with whom I would not or could not have a sexual relationship; It is very rare that I end up with a crush on one.

Still, a lot of this platonic vs. romantic rule-making seems silly to me.  Am I too idealistic in just thinking people can just be friends, the kind of friends that the friendship naturally develops into, and express love in ways that feel respectful, kind, and compassionate, without fearing that there is some kind of ulterior motive or hidden meaning inferred from their actions that wasn't actually part of the intent?  I dunno, I can see how that can work (in friendships where you know your friend operates in a very loving and affectionate way and that it doesn't mean they're trying to rope you into something).  I can also see how that wouldn't work (if a friend has a history of using lovey-dovey behavior to open the door and then launch a romantic sneak-attack on you when you least expect [or want] it).

Either way, the fact stands that I love my close friendships, and this, honestly, is how I prefer my friendships to be.  While there are some people with whom I know on a spiritual level I am supposed to be friends, even if it isn't (yet or ever) looking like the way I'm used to my friendships looking, I tend to be uninterested in superficial connections with people.  I like the long talks, the hugs, and the love.  At this time, I have around 8 close friends (although 4 of them do not live local to me) with whom I have that kind of intimacy.  Visits and phone calls are ended with "I love you," we call each other "honey" and "sweetie" and "love," and would be each other's 3 am friend, should one ever be needed.  I have one more friend with whom I feel that same level of love, but I'm still not sure where I stand with him (as he's not very expressive about lovey feelings with friends, that I've seen).  And I have a handful of other friends where some level of hugginess and affection is the norm, if not the overt "I love you" type.  As far as I can tell, this is a good thing.  Love is good.  Letting other people know you care about them is good.  Reaching into each other's lives, if even for a period of time, to love and be loved even in a non-sexual or non-romantic way is good.

Any relationship, sexual or non-sexual, has the weight and power that you give it.  If it is a friendship, then it's a friendship.  If it's family, then it's family, whether related by blood or not.  If it's a significant other, then it's a significant other, even if it doesn't fit society's definition of SO.

And if the opportunity for a loving and committed relationship with someone who will not or could not be sexually involved with me were ever to present itself, I don't think I'd reject that opportunity just because it wouldn't fit a pre-defined expectation of what a relationship should be.

I know there are a few of you who actually read this.  You've let me know without officially following the blog, liking it on facebook, or commenting.  But this is something I'd love more thoughts on.  Comments welcomed, even if you don't want your username shown (though you'll still have to wait for me to approve it).

Dating someone who is already in a committed relationship

So, after my post the other day talking about how a poly relationship can be fair to someone coming into an already-established relationship, I sent out an email to my local poly list to ask their thoughts on it all.  Here's a particularly thoughtful response I got from someone, whose permission I've received to post portions of the response here.  Nothing like a little mental nutrition to get the thoughts rolling...

Special thanks to B for sharing this with me and the others on the list.

I've been there, in different ways.

The key to "meeting the needs" of the third (or really any) person is
that it depends on what the needs are. Not everyone is in a place
where they want to get married, have a long term committed
relationship, or have short term relations, or or or...

So what needs are being talked about to begin with? In the non-poly
world, the assumption is that you have a monogamous relationship and
that (eventually) one of these results in marriage. Underneath that
is a common belief that relationships that aren't aimed towards
marriage are pointless or weird or a waste of time (this is mainly a
southern thing, I didn't get as much of this in DC).

And this is a mistake that leads to a lot of strife out there: people
assume an all-fitting box that is "a relationship" when really all
people and all relationships are different and everyone needs
different things, no matter how subtle the differences are.

By pretending everyone needs the same thing or things, there are LOTS
of problems in 'typical' relationships.

So, have I been the 'third party' and gotten my needs met? yes.

The advice I would give is the same as for anyone dating anyone in any
circumstance: know theyself, and understand the person you want to be
in a relationship as well.

What do they want to give, open to give, like to give? What do you
have to give? What needs does everyone have? Does it fit?

If the answer is no then the relationship will have issues. If the
answer is yes the relationship will work until those needs change. I
was in an open relationship for a while that worked until the girl I
was seeing became clear that what she needed was something more
permanent (marriage). We had long ago discussed that I wasn't in a
place where I wanted to get married (to anyone). We broke up (but
kept seeing each other) until she found someone who fit her needs
including the new one. Then we stopped seeing each other (the other
person wasn't poly). We DID remain friends and eventually her (now)
husband realized that I was cool and not some jealous boyfriend guy.
I was happy for her because I wanted her to be happy, and our needs
and ability to give no longer matched up. This was just fine by me.

The only way any relationship works (no matter the number of people
involved) is through good communication. The more people, the more
communication usually needed. And you can only communicate your needs
if you know them. Most people actually don't. And so you have to
work hard at knowing yourself and harder at reading people and their
needs and most of all learn the skills to deal with less than perfect
communications and the misunderstandings that ensue.

There are a lot more "open relationship" people than people who
directly identify as "poly". That's a whole different can of worms
really. Many times when people hear poly they think "open
relationship" and that causes some misunderstandings from the start.

I really appreciated these comments, particularly the part about most people not really knowing what they want in the first place.  I know that I have a wide spectrum of things that would fit the definition of "what I want" in a relationship, because my needs are broad enough in some ways to allow for multiple expressions of love to meet them.  But I do see quite a few people who haven't given a lot of thought to or clarified for themselves what their needs are, so they either A) adopt a set of socially and culturally normative "needs" as their own without much reflection to whether or not it's a good match for them at any given time in their lives, or B) decide that socially and culturally normative "needs" are bogus and blow them off without honestly reflecting on what a set of replacement "needs" that might fill that void in a positive way would look like.

This, I believe, is at least partially the reason for many of the "OMG POLYAMORY that is so WEEEEEEIIIIRRRRRDDD" responses I sometimes get, even from people who cheat on their partners regularly and have lovers on the side.  I've gotten that reaction from people who would otherwise be cool with dating a married person as long as it were done in secret (as if that is somehow a more acceptable way of going about it).

 I remember what went through my mind the first time someone I knew came out to me as polyamorous and explained it as a lifestyle.  My thoughts were something along this line: "HO-LEE CRAP, that is some weird stuff.  More power to ya if it's working for you, but I can't imagine ever doing that myself."  Luckily, the first person who ever mentioned polyamory to me was a gay man who was interested in having a purely intellectual discussion with me about it (and not someone who was hitting on me, which might have been even harder for me to wrap my head around).  Without the pressure of an impending potential relationship, I was able to go home, think about it, chat about it with my partner, and within a year we were (at least mentally) on board with it.  About the time we were ready to give it a shot, we ended up moving to a very, VERY conservative town and nothing came of it for years (until we relocated again, this time to a very progressive area).  But I think my initial response to hearing about poly wasn't MY response-- it was a socially conditioned response that I had accepted as a norm without any reflection.  A little reflection later, and here we are, moving into poly ourselves.

At any rate, I appreciate the first-hand reflection and advice from someone who has been a "tertiary" partner to someone already in a committed relationship.

Interestingly, my request for experiences from those in a tertiary relationship to share their thoughts with me has led to an off-list email and continuing discussion from and with someone who is currently in a relationship with a person in a committed relationship, who had been quietly going through her own anxieties about whether or not the other partner could truly care about her experience, feelings, and needs.  What a refreshing connection to make and conversation to have, even if it isn't MY metamour, and I'm not hers.  The universe has truly blessed me with good people at the right times.  I have not reason to doubt that would continue.

The future is more fluid than you think...

So, let me get this out there right from the start.  Some "polyamorous" people are cruisers, looking for someone to "play," not interested in even the possibility of longer-term relationship, and possibly not even very nice people.  As I've said before, everyone defines it a little differently, which leads to all sorts of outcomes and ways of being poly, some of which may not reflect kindly on those of us who are poly and good people.

I recently told a friend (who knows I'm poly but isn't necessarily supportive of the idea) that I was interested in someone that I may or may not end up dating.  My friend asked me what I thought about it.  I said I thought it might be great.  She then said, "Well, I wonder what she thinks about it."  She wasn't unkind, but her tone clearly indicated that the only way a potential partner to a previously partnered poly person could feel (holy alliteration, batman!) is somehow deprived or mistreated.


This take on poly offends me a bit, and leaves me shaking my head.  It's like people assume that because you're poly, it's just like cheating, but with permission.  There's an assumption that the additional partner's needs could never be met, that they would always not matter enough to you, that it wouldn't be like "real" love.  There's the assumption that the primary partner is the "real" partner, and that any other partners would just be an accessory, deprived, not treated fairly, or whatever.  


The truth is, as much as my husband and I have an idea in our mind of how polyamory might play out, there's a lot of flexibility in that vision based on the specific needs of any people that either of us might date.  If one of us ends up dating someone who isn't looking for a long-term, live-in thing, that's going to shape how it turns out.  If one of us ends up dating someone who dreams of one day having that, THAT will shape out it all turns out and what we're open to.  If one of us dates someone who has no interest in dating the other, that changes the game, just as it does if one of us dates someone who eventually wants to date the other.  It's fluid, see?  It's open to possibility, as all good potentials are.


So, to give you some kind of idea what goes on in the minds of a poly couple (who talk about everything, by the way) with regard to how anyone we end up dating would be treated, read on...


WOULD WE DATE SOMEONE WHO WANTED TO DATE US BOTH?
Yes.  However, that seems like an awfully complicated setup to start out with out of the gate.  We would be open to the possibility, of course, but it seems more likely that someone would have an initial attraction to one of us, and that we'd allow that relationship to progress on it's on, with any additional attractions to the other one of us being allowed to grow organically, if at all.  Besides, having a metamour can be fun, in and of itself.

WOULD ONE DATE SOMEONE WHO HAD NO INTEREST IN DATING THE OTHER?
Yes.  If someone's orientation (gay or straight, for example) or just plain ol' compatibility or attraction led to only being interested in one of us, forever, no exceptions, that would be fine as well, PROVIDED the potential partner honored and respected the pre-existing relationship and pre-existing partner.  I can't imagine a scenario in which we'd want to date someone who wasn't already decent friends with our primary partner.  Ideally, for me anyway, I'd want whoever was dating my husband to feel at least a little bit of a connection with me, even if it is more of a close friend or sister-like connection.  At a minimum, I want to know I can trust them to not go all cowboy and try to destroy my marriage.  (I just read that paragraph out loud to my husband, and he agrees.)  If you want to date one of us, a good first step as you are becoming or after becoming friends with the one you're interested in would be to become good friends with the other.  If you find my partner completely uninteresting or not your friendship-type, our relationship probably wouldn't work out anyway.

That last fact out of the way, I'm going to just assume it's clear in any future questions that we're open to either one or both of us dating someone, even if the wording says "we."


WOULD YOU DATE SOMEONE WHO HAD NO INTEREST IN LIVING IN A THREE- (OR MORE) ADULT HOUSEHOLD, EVER?
Yes.  Living together is not a requirement for dating, friendship, love, or more.  It all just depends on the person.  But yes, we can envision a scenario in which we could have long-term relationships with someone we knew would never live with us.

WOULD YOU DATE SOMEONE YOU KNEW WOULD, DOWN THE LINE, ONLY BE HAPPY LIVING TOGETHER?
Yes.  If someone becomes a true, loving, soul-mate kind of partner to one or both of us, we are open to the idea of living together in a multi-adult household.  Yes, we have kids.  And yes, if we truly loved someone and it was the right time, we'd take on the challenge of explaining poly to our children and working through the challenges of a multi-adult household, as well as facing any social stuff that came up because of it.

DO YOU TALK TO EACH OTHER ABOUT YOUR RELATIONSHIPS AND DATING?
Yes.  You have to keep in mind that we are each others' confidantes.  Thus far, we talk to each other about how we feel about people we may or may not be attracted to, things that happen and are said with those people, and more.  It isn't so much in a gossip-y way or to violate trust, but because we are in the habit of being completely honest with each other.  That said, I'm having to get myself comfortable with the fact that if my husband ends up in a relationship with someone else, he will probably eventually end up with another confidante, who will know the kinds of private things about my life I only share with him.  It's a leap of trust, you know?  I have to trust that my partner has chosen someone to be in relationship with who is trustworthy in every way, and then I have to let it go.  So yeah, I know how it might be a little weird to know that someone else has access to your love's intimate thoughts, in large part because it's an idea I'm also working on for myself.

DO YOU GET JEALOUS OF YOUR PARTNER HAVING OTHER ROMANTIC RELATIONSHIPS/INTERACTIONS?
Yes.  Sometimes, it's really more of envy, if I'm being honest.  If one of us has a potential romantic attraction coming over the horizon and the other doesn't at the moment, it's more likely that we might be experiencing envy ("How come HE has someone into him and I don't?") than jealousy ("I don't like him having someone other than me.").  But we do sometimes experience jealousy.  And it isn't that we ignore it, but rather that it's a feeling we work through until we have some sense of resolution.  We talk about it, love each other through it, and keep reminding each other of how special our relationship is.

Also, we have both, at least a few times, experienced what they call "compersion."  That just means that seeing your partner enjoy someone else's company, happy and finding joy in a second (or third) relationship, brings YOU joy because you love them so much and want happiness for them.  I have experienced what I could truly call compersion more than a couple of times so far, and we aren't even that far into our poly journey yet.  I've also experienced envy.  I find that I feel a bit of jealousy when I think of my husband with some other unknown person, but have not yet felt jealousy when it has been a case of "[name], who I know and is safe to me, is into my husband" or "my husband has a thing for [name], who I know and trust."  If one of us has ever called you a "safe" person or said we trust you, you're golden, if you're ever interested in asking the other out on a date.

ASK!
I guess the most obvious thing to say is that if someone who is poly expresses an interest in you, or you think that you might be interested in someone who is poly, but you aren't sure if they would be open to X, Y, or Z that would meet your needs now or at some point in the future, just ask!  There's nothing wrong with saying, "I don't know that I want to feel like I'm always second place.  How would you deal with that?" Or, "How do you and your partner deal with jealousy?  I'm scared of being thrown out on my ass at his/her whim."  Be upfront.  Don't assume you know what the answer is.  And if you might be interested but need some time to process this whole poly idea, say that, too.  One of the coolest things I've discovered thus far about the poly people I know is how receptive to open communication they are.  Boundaries are negotiated, respected, and revised as needed.  Goals are discussed.  Attractions are openly expressed, but not necessarily assumed to be forever lovefests, and are still allowed to progress on their own, in their own time.  Discussing a potential future does not secure you into having one, but can help put minds at ease in the mean time.  Be honest.  Be upfront.  And be ready for what could turn out to be a whole lot of love, joy, and fulfillment.

.....

Honestly, I am curious about hearing from those poly folk who have been in a relationship with one or both of an already-established couple, and what that was like for you.  I'm not particularly interested in those who felt they were in a "unicorn" setup, or had someone who was unfair to them.  But if you were in a relationship with one or both people who were either married, or already in a committed relationship, how did it work?  What was that like for you?  How did you and the others make sure your needs were met?  What tips would you offer someone who was interested in someone who is poly and in a committed relationship, but not sure how they felt about the idea?  Feel free to send me a message via facebook at: http://www.facebook.com/omnipoly (Please note that I do not post via that account, ever.  It's just a nice way to reach me if you want to).  Maybe a guest post is in order!  :-)